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PostPosted: Aug 13, 2017 1:50 
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They held back in the marketing which was a good thing in the sense that they left the story a mystery and allowed the gameplay to speak for itself which was either presented from reviewer feedback behind closed doors/VR impressions or bite sized clips and trailers that only gave you sample portions of what to expect.

It's a double edge sword because they want to surprise gamers and yet they can't hype up the greatest parts without spoiling the game.

Hopefully the word of mouth and good impressions will carry over to RE8 if history has taught us anything.


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PostPosted: Aug 13, 2017 2:37 
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Robyn wrote:

The marketing felt cheap and untrustworthy. If developers have to actually come out and inform people that "This game will not have ghosts" or "Yeah that mannequin finger can't actually be used right now..." Then something is wrong.



That's where they clearly tried to mimic the buzz PT got with the mystery but ultimately, as you said, it felt cheap.

News Bot wrote:
The marketing was good from a plot standpoint as it made the story virtually entirely brand new going into the main game--


I can't disagree with that. Though personally, the plot in any given game takes a backseat to the gameplay so it didn't work for me. And I have to say that based on the final demo, I had the impression that the final game won't be very linear.


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PostPosted: Aug 13, 2017 3:42 
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Blackbird wrote:
It's so hard to do that nowadays. Make people hunt for news, try to get their hands on foreign prints of magazines, translate articles to have something to discuss. While i saw many people saying it was mimicking PT, Outlast, whatever you say, i saw many more people engaging and being togheter to solve the mistery behind what RE7 really was, and that's magical in a world where basically all the information is available on the internet.

You see, this kind of extreme teasing only works on people who are already exited. For those who are not exited at all or who are sitting on the fence it has the direct opposite effect. I love action RE and I think RE should be in third person so RE7 reveal has left me disappointing to no end, but they still had like a 5% chance to hook me up with a honest showing of what they had. Instead I've got a handful of PT-style 5 seconds long videos and a demo with no combat.
Teasing woks when you expect to get the best ever sex in your life. When you already expect to get a kick in the nuts, teasing is the last thing you want. Just kick me already and lets be done with it. Stop the never ending waiting torture.
Hope you've got the idea.


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PostPosted: Aug 13, 2017 6:06 
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Quote:
People who compares everything on horror, have so little effort to understand their differences, nuances and what makes all them special. No one should just straight up call it "generic horror title".

Outlast was a horror game about pursuit, made by developers who left the team behind Mirror's Edge, to create this title with elements of parkour and timing to left you pursuer behind.

P.T. was a playable teaser from the Kojima Productions, wich wanted to make a title that could actually scare players. An psychological horror that toys with your mind, experimenting with the public's expectations while bulding a new level of terror, focusing on a twisted, midfuck storytelling about personal interpretations of hell.


No one answered to that tho, and this makes me feel worried seeing how few people care about the depths of any game, wich is where most of the details and qualities are anyway. By comparing it on any "generic horror title" (that sounds so condescending) basically you are diminuing the value of the games involved, like they are simple as "a first person/run and hide/supernatural horror title". It's such an cynical way of describing what you know little of, or just don't care enough to give credit.

My main problem with that argument, saying "the marketing didn't represent the game", is exactly what SG79 said earlier. RE7 was revealed little by little. That said, is it right to judge a game knowing that many parts of it didn't even were announced yet? It's like saying: "Capcom didn't show this elements early, so it's only logical that the game doesn't has it" or "They would show it for us by now, i don't trust Capcom so they'll do it just like PT/Outlast".

By the end of 2016/near the launch, basically everyone had all the information they needed available. There was three updates from the demo, three big trailers (tapes, as they called it), previews articles/videos from almost every big site/youtubers and a series of videos named "The World of Resident Evil 7", showing all the elements from the game. It was just a matter of waiting and being patient.

And if you go from the demo, just like i said before, it didn't hurt me to see for what it was. I'm not an industry analist, but even as a fan it was clear to me that it was just a social experiment, like a big company trying to engage with fans while promoting a new game. And even if you didn't saw that at the time, they said several times that it didn't represent the full title, It was just a glimpse of the feeling that you get while playing it.

By now it's very clear to me, many people just don't like being teased like that. It's sad because i had such an blast with friends speculating about it before launch. While some were a little confused and scared after the announce, most people i knew were calm after reading news, articles and interviews about the game. Most of the information was there, not in trailers or demos anyway. It sucks for everyone that didn't had the time to do so, or didn't knew how to find this information. I understand both situations.

Quote:
You've completely ignored my point that fans' trust of Capcom had deteriorated over the years. Post RE4 (12 years now), every main game was said to be a "return to horror". Or did you think that RE5 or 6 were horror? In another topic, you accurately criticized overt negativity among fans but you're on the complete opposite spectrum here. All I said that they way the handled the unveiling and pre-release promotion wasn't particularly great.


Sorry if didn't mentioned that, it is so much to discuss that it's hard to get everything for the first time (i've edited this post several times just to be as good as possible). And by that, i'm just discussing with you. Sorry if i look a little heated, i don't want to disrespect anyone here.

For being honest, despite being a fan since i was 7 years old, it took me years to start engaging with the RE community/news, so i didn't experience Capcom saying 5 was a return to horror. At that time, i just thought it was an updated RE4. So i didn't knew that. And when 6 launched, it didn't surprised me, i was happy for what it was (i haven't even played any other horror games/classic RE at that point), because i didn't had a frame of reference to know how different it was.


I saw Robyn saying how it was made for VR as well (i want to play on it so bad). I even talked with someone about how it became an option on Reddit, so if you care enough about game development or just how RE7 was made, give it a read (there's a zoom option on the upper left of the picture):

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PostPosted: Aug 13, 2017 7:31 
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Good arguments, but one thing the demo did convey from the final game was atmosphere.

The "Go tell Aunt Rhody" teaser gave me goosbumps.
When the music reaches it's climax, and images representing the final game flash onscreen,
Spoiler:
like Evelyn in her chair
it was like a high of sorts.

The problems people had with story presentation are understandable. But I always assumed everything linked somehow back to the series.

My biggest fear was it was going to be totally stand alone. And while it didn't connect things as much as, say 5,
building on the subtle hints from Umbrella Corp and
Spoiler:
potentialy bringing back the rival organization
made me happy.

When I saw the three simple letters
Spoiler:
"HCF"
my jaw literally dropped. Was NOT expecting that.
Hopefully Capcom are planning a long range plot centered around BU.

Added the spoiler tags in case anyone reading somehow hasn't played it yet.

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PostPosted: Aug 13, 2017 7:59 
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EvilResident wrote:
Good arguments, but one thing the demo did convey from the final game was atmosphere.

The "Go tell Aunt Rhody" teaser gave me goosbumps.
When the music reaches it's climax, and images representing the final game flash onscreen,
Spoiler:
like Evelyn in her chair
it was like a high of sorts.

The problems people had with story presentation are understandable. But I always assumed everything linked somehow back to the series.

My biggest fear was it was going to be totally stand alone. And while it didn't connect things as much as, say 5,
building on the subtle hints from Umbrella Corp and
Spoiler:
potentialy bringing back the rival organization
made me happy.

When I say the three simple letters
Spoiler:
"HCF"
my jaw literally dropped. Was NOT expecting that.
Hopefully Capcom are planning a long range plot centered around BU.

Added the spoiler tags in case anyone reading somehow hasn't played it yet.


I'm very excited to know what they'll bring to the series next, if they expand correctly on this elements it will be amazing.

Mikami said that the first Evil Within was more on the style of RE4, and now from recent interviews he says that TEW2 will be more like Resident Evil 1, so i'm curious to see what RE will do now.

There is a chance of RE8 being the Resident Evil 2 of this trilogy. If they build upon 7 and add more complexity, like more enemy variety, bigger and open areas (contribuing to the feeling of being lost and discovering how it all connects, with secrects along the way), with random events like:
Spoiler:
Jack breaking the wall
and
Spoiler:
the leg amputation
it would be GOTY for sure.

It's hard to say right now. Maybe it will be very different from RE7, but we can only hope.

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PostPosted: Aug 13, 2017 8:10 
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I couldn't agree with him more. RE7 was the first game from Capcom in a long time that actually impressed (as well as scare) me and made me feel like I was playing classic RE again.

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PostPosted: Aug 13, 2017 9:15 
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Blackbird wrote:
EvilResident wrote:
Good arguments, but one thing the demo did convey from the final game was atmosphere.

The "Go tell Aunt Rhody" teaser gave me goosbumps.
When the music reaches it's climax, and images representing the final game flash onscreen,
Spoiler:
like Evelyn in her chair
it was like a high of sorts.

The problems people had with story presentation are understandable. But I always assumed everything linked somehow back to the series.

My biggest fear was it was going to be totally stand alone. And while it didn't connect things as much as, say 5,
building on the subtle hints from Umbrella Corp and
Spoiler:
potentialy bringing back the rival organization
made me happy.

When I say the three simple letters
Spoiler:
"HCF"
my jaw literally dropped. Was NOT expecting that.
Hopefully Capcom are planning a long range plot centered around BU.

Added the spoiler tags in case anyone reading somehow hasn't played it yet.


I'm very excited to know what they'll bring to the series next, if they expand correctly on this elements it will be amazing.

Mikami said that the first Evil Within was more on the style of RE4, and now from recent interviews he says that TEW2 will be more like Resident Evil 1, so i'm curious to see what RE will do now.

There is a chance of RE8 being the Resident Evil 2 of this trilogy. If they build upon 7 and add more complexity, like more enemy variety, bigger and open areas (contribuing to the feeling of being lost and discovering how it all connects, with secrects along the way), with random events like:
Spoiler:
Jack breaking the wall
and
Spoiler:
the leg amputation
it would be GOTY for sure.

It's hard to say right now. Maybe it will be very different from RE7, but we can only hope.

Agreed.
If you ever want to talk about TEW2, there is a topic for it under general gaming.

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PostPosted: Aug 13, 2017 13:16 
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Quote:
No one answered to that tho, and this makes me feel worried seeing how few people care about the depths of any game, wich is where most of the details and qualities are anyway. By comparing it on any "generic horror title" (that sounds so condescending) basically you are diminuing the value of the games involved, like they are simple as "a first person/run and hide/supernatural horror title". It's such an cynical way of describing what you know little of, or just don't care enough to give credit.


Because it's entirely irrelevant to what was being discussed and way off topic, as we are really now at this stage. The issue at hand was that the initial reveal and demos of RE7 gave that impression, hence why I'm critical of it.

You had an extremely long response to that simple point of mine, and all you're doing now is doubling down and moving in circles with more long posts. You said this yourself, so you may as well stop:

That's an obvius conclusion after all feedback they received. I'm not contesting what happened, what people thought about the game at the time, neither saying that it couldn't be handled better in some ways.


Quote:
My main problem with that argument, saying "the marketing didn't represent the game", is exactly what SG79 said earlier. RE7 was revealed little by little. That said, is it right to judge a game knowing that many parts of it didn't even were announced yet? It's like saying: "Capcom didn't show this elements early, so it's only logical that the game doesn't has it" or "They would show it for us by now, i don't trust Capcom so they'll do it just like PT/Outlast".


You've either deliberately ignored what's been said or misunderstood the point entirely. I'll quote myself in one area that address this. The rest is all there so you can re-read it.

Quote:
I get you were a fan of the "peel the mysterious layers of our game little by little" campaign but again, I did not find it that good or enjoyable because it didn't present the final product very well. Essentially most of the elements that I enjoyed weren't there. You're making it sound as if it's impossible to promote a game without spoiling everything but that's nonsense. Keeping in mind that we're talking about the initial reveal and the various demos leading to the final one here.


The first trailer and demos, void of enemies, combat and had abstract type puzzles that were not unlike your stock first person horror game. Hence generic looking and didn't represent the final product well. I really can't be any more clear here. RE4's campaign on the other hand including the demos represented the game well from the start leading to release.

I even provided a clip of Nakanishi saying it was a misstep but you kept peddling the same thing over and over, blaming fans exclusively for getting the wrong impression. Like I said, you're on the opposite side of the fans being overly critical of the game.


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PostPosted: Aug 13, 2017 16:02 
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SG79 wrote:
Quote:
No one answered to that tho, and this makes me feel worried seeing how few people care about the depths of any game, wich is where most of the details and qualities are anyway. By comparing it on any "generic horror title" (that sounds so condescending) basically you are diminuing the value of the games involved, like they are simple as "a first person/run and hide/supernatural horror title". It's such an cynical way of describing what you know little of, or just don't care enough to give credit.


Because it's entirely irrelevant to what was being discussed and way off topic, as we are really now at this stage. The issue at hand was that the initial reveal and demos of RE7 gave that impression, hence why I'm critical of it.

You had an extremely long response to that simple point of mine, and all you're doing now is doubling down and moving in circles with more long posts. You said this yourself, so you may as well stop:

That's an obvius conclusion after all feedback they received. I'm not contesting what happened, what people thought about the game at the time, neither saying that it couldn't be handled better in some ways.


Quote:
My main problem with that argument, saying "the marketing didn't represent the game", is exactly what SG79 said earlier. RE7 was revealed little by little. That said, is it right to judge a game knowing that many parts of it didn't even were announced yet? It's like saying: "Capcom didn't show this elements early, so it's only logical that the game doesn't has it" or "They would show it for us by now, i don't trust Capcom so they'll do it just like PT/Outlast".


You've either deliberately ignored what's been said or misunderstood the point entirely. I'll quote myself in one area that address this. The rest is all there so you can re-read it.

Quote:
I get you were a fan of the "peel the mysterious layers of our game little by little" campaign but again, I did not find it that good or enjoyable because it didn't present the final product very well. Essentially most of the elements that I enjoyed weren't there. You're making it sound as if it's impossible to promote a game without spoiling everything but that's nonsense. Keeping in mind that we're talking about the initial reveal and the various demos leading to the final one here.


The first trailer and demos, void of enemies, combat and had abstract type puzzles that were not unlike your stock first person horror game. Hence generic looking and didn't represent the final product well. I really can't be any more clear here. RE4's campaign on the other hand including the demos represented the game well from the start leading to release.

I even provided a clip of Nakanishi saying it was a misstep but you kept peddling the same thing over and over, blaming fans exclusively for getting the wrong impression. Like I said, you're on the opposite side of the fans being overly critical of the game.


I'm going to put an end to this argument because it's getting the thread deraild for a long time, but i'll repeat what i said on my final conclusion just to be clear:
Quote:
By now it's very clear to me, many people just don't like being teased like that. It's sad because i had such an blast with friends speculating about it before launch. While some were a little confused and scared after the announce, most people i knew were calm after reading news, articles and interviews about the game. Most of the information was there, not in trailers or demos anyway. It sucks for everyone that didn't had the time to do so, or didn't knew how to find this information. I understand both situations.


The main problem here was that sometimes we were having a complete different talk about the subject. You were aiming on something while i was trying to discuss another. Whether is my falt, yours, at this point i don't really care, but you can blame me on that one if you want to, even if i think that obviously nobody is to blame on this.

I'll just add that yes, what i said on the beggining are facts. I can't contest if most people liked it and enjoyed their experience waiting for the game. The majority of fans didn't, and that's quite clear at this point.

What i'm really trying to say, is that maybe the market shouldn't be completely targered as straight up bad, like a "gaffe" as you replied to me on the first place. It was different, for sure, but i still think that some people reacted too fast and didn't waited to draw any conclusion.

And that's mainly because i'm not the only one that was okay on how it was delivered. Maybe we are on the minority, but it wasn't impossible to understand what type of game was being made at that time. While i agree that some aspects could mislead uninformed idividuals, it didn't need to had such an negative reaction.

Nakanishi may understand what went wrong right now, but it's probably a bit of stretch to say that it was a complete misstep, at least from the answer he gave.

It all comes from a matter of taste, trying to sell it as a fact will put us both on a never-ending cycle. I had a blast while waiting RE7, and i'm sorry that it didn't showed what the game really was to you, but at the same time, it was great to discuss with someone from the opposite angle about this.

And by saying that, i'm completely fine putting a line behind all this right now, so i'll quote myself one more time just to be completely clear about how i feel on this matter:
Quote:
i'm just discussing with you. Sorry if i look a little heated, i don't want to disrespect anyone here.

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